~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
There is nothing better than when a commenter gives you the gift of a blog post. Buff, from Opinions and Rectums, left the following comment on my most recent Friday Wrap-Up post:
There is nothing better than when a commenter gives you the gift of a blog post. Buff, from Opinions and Rectums, left the following comment on my most recent Friday Wrap-Up post:I read an article that stated divorces were down, because with the recession, people can't afford to divorce right now- and are staying together until an upturn in the economy...
Turns out this isn't just a trend, but an epidemic. In Chicago, for example, there was a 5% drop in divorce filings in the first three quarters of 2008 - and that was before the economy really went to shit took a significant downturn. The American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers ... wait ... really? There is an American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers? Anyway, they report that 37% of its membership has seen a drop in their divorce business. And a recent survey conducted by the Institute of Divorce Financial Analysts - another "Who knew?" group - found that 68% of its members "have seen clients who could not afford to get divorced because of recession-related financial problems."
We all know that financial woes are the biggest cause of marital spats. It's certainly been on husband and my Top 10 list. So, with the economy being what it is, you'd expect lots of husbands and wives to be at each others throats and contemplating divorce. However, this recession is so bad that people are putting off any decision that will cost a lot of money ... including divorce.
I know many of you find it distasteful to look at marriage in economic terms, but humor me for a minute and consider the economics of divorce. Not only are there attorney's fees to be paid, but the value of the two biggest assets of most marriages - the home and retirement plans - have diminished dramatically. It seems that many couples, faced with the prospect of halving their shrunken assets, are deciding to stick it out a while.
Sure, you may be looking forward to happier days of an economic recovery, but there are some of us out there who are waiting patiently to be able to afford to experience the "pain and suffering" of divorce.
Tell me what you think. If physical violence is not an issue, and emotional bullying can be kept to a minimum, does it make better sense to postpone divorce, or should the parties involved just suck it up, swallow their loss, and make it official?
We all know that financial woes are the biggest cause of marital spats. It's certainly been on husband and my Top 10 list. So, with the economy being what it is, you'd expect lots of husbands and wives to be at each others throats and contemplating divorce. However, this recession is so bad that people are putting off any decision that will cost a lot of money ... including divorce.
I know many of you find it distasteful to look at marriage in economic terms, but humor me for a minute and consider the economics of divorce. Not only are there attorney's fees to be paid, but the value of the two biggest assets of most marriages - the home and retirement plans - have diminished dramatically. It seems that many couples, faced with the prospect of halving their shrunken assets, are deciding to stick it out a while.
Sure, you may be looking forward to happier days of an economic recovery, but there are some of us out there who are waiting patiently to be able to afford to experience the "pain and suffering" of divorce.
Tell me what you think. If physical violence is not an issue, and emotional bullying can be kept to a minimum, does it make better sense to postpone divorce, or should the parties involved just suck it up, swallow their loss, and make it official?
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
42 comments:
suck it up, swallow their loss, and make it official!!!!!!!
I guess it just depends if economics or love is the overriding factor for a person or persons. I gave up nearly everything I had in terms of "stuff". Things are now merely average at best for me in terms of "stuff", but I sleep well at night. Cheers!!
Finances definitely play a part in any marriage. It can be as big a problem as you make it. My wife and I have never critized each other's spending habits on the small stuff, and on the big stuff we always talk first until we more or less agree. I don't know your situation beyond what you have chosen to share on your blog. Divorcing, and still doing co-habitation for awhile is not unheard of these days... Also, divorces do not require a lawyer- but if you don't trust the individual you are divorcing, it is probably money well spent. Your head and your heart are both needed in a decision like this..tough call... Good Luck.
Most of us get married in church. The rest of the folks get married in the courthouse or by a judge who makes house calls. Divorce however, always ends up in the courthouse. Marriage when it ends for whatever reason, like death, the toilet seat left up or boredom calls for a legal procedure.
If after we decided to get married because of our deep love of the other person. We would step back and look at the business side of marriage. We would be better off. Marriage. whether we like it or not, is much like a contract. Divorce is revoking the contract. With the assets and emotions it can get messy.
So I think that right now folks are looking at the economic issues of divorce. And that's a good thing methinks.
I am a memeber of the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers and NJ Division of Matrimonial and Family Law. I have been to national conferences and everything!
I know divorce is about money. It is dissolution of business deal for lack of a better comparison. And to be honest attorney's fees are only very expensive when one or both parties let their emotions overrule logic.
BUT I cannot accept that marriage is about money. Partners in a marriage should never be valued by or judged on their financial contribution to the relationship. That leads to an imbalance of power in the relationship. And that is not a "Marriage" in my definition.
If you married for love, hey some don't, then forget the fairytale remember the vow, suck it up and make it work.
Sometimes I wonder if we wouldn't all be better off if we did not cohabitate but merely comingled?
I guess it would depend on how badly one or both parties wanted to be away from each other. If things were very tense, for example, it would be better to just be done with it. That's a hard one....
Unless there's abuse, I think people ought to try to stick it out. Somethings are not as bad as they seem.
In the case of infidelity, the problem was most likely there BEFORE the affair occurred.
Poor communication is usually the biggest issue.
Well...it makes sense financially to divorce NOW. Think about it - your assets are worth less...meaning you'd be paying less in alimony and discounted lawyer fees. Hmm? LOL
Divorce has always been an expensive proposition. I guess right now a lot of men have just lost too much money in the secret investment fund that the wife doesn't know about and just can't afford a divorce. ;-)
perkins, there's one for take the financial loss and call it a day!
Matt-Man, at this point, finding another "love" is so far off my radar it isn't even funny. Executing a cut and run maneuver will almost certainly put me in a place of never experiencing home ownership again and filing bankruptcy. I'm leaning towards the "wait it out and see if losses can be minimized" option.
buffalodick, I think we could make it out of this without the lawyers - there are no issues of child support, visitation, splitting assets (as they are all currently liabilities), spousal maintenance, etc. The biggest issue for me is insuring neither of us is worse off than the other and that each would have a "reasonable" opportunity to secure home ownership, and a "comfortable" retirement, in the future.
Ditch it and move on.
Was that too subtle?
I wasn't speaking neccesarily of you, I was talking about people in general. And please, I would never imply that people need to find another love to replace the one they left. Finding another love, is not part of my equation in my comment. Cheers!!
we're doomed, what is possibly unusual in this situation is that although we are both extremely unhappy (for different reasons), neither of us is in the spite/payback mode. Being in our mid/late 40's, not addressing the long-term financial impact of disolving this marriage is nothing short of burying our heads in the sand.
Karen, I agree with everything you said - marriage should NEVER be about money, powere nor control. But we are already there and in our case, it only became an issue when husband's salary exceeded mine significantly. Now it's time (maybe) to address where we are instead of wishing it were different - it's just a matter of how we get through that process.
Lu', and this is my preference, however I think there comes a time when you *must* address t6he emotional cost to both parties to do that. Life is short - none of us want to spend half of it miserable.
Evil Twin's Wife, I agree, and although things now are relatively peaceful, I'm well aware that they could change in an instant, and that that change could be far more damaging in the long run than filing for bankruptcy.
Ashleigh, we've dealt with the abuse issue (both physical and emotional) in the past (with about 8 months of current success), and infidelity doesn't seem to be an issue (although there are certainly red flags - I just don't care to explore them). I have a difficult time admitting failure when there is still "love" between two people, and that - along with the financial impact - are what keep me on the fence.
Nolens Volens, we have no assets (only liabilities) and alimony is not something I'd ever ask for, so we're back at ground zero here!
Jay, BWAHAHAHA! Actually, that might not be so far from the truth in this case, but I don't want his money - just the opportunity to own a home again at some point in the future!
Real Live Lesbian, hmmmm ... I'm not sure that was quite clear enough *wink*
Matt-Man, I guess I'm confused by, "I guess it just depends if economics or love is the overriding factor for a person or persons." At this point, I care about what happens to husband (and I'm fairly certain he feels the same about me), but there is no "romantic love" between us - it's more like a brother/sister relationship (and yes, without any sex). Soooo ... since there isn't any love, that leaves economics ... yes? Or am I completely misunderstanding your comment?
No you're not misunderstanding my comment. A couple can divorce or get a dissolution without any (or as minimal) pain as there can be to the other if they choose so and they work out an amicable agreement.
If that can happen why stay together if there is no love?..I thought love was the reason for marriage, not a symbiotic economic reason.
Cheers!!
...when ya gotta go, ya gotta go...
For me? If I end up going down the road of my last two marriages, I would walk in a heartbeat.
After all...when I die, I can't take it with me anyway so I may as well be happy.
We avoided the lawyers. I sucked it up and am paying her very fairly for 9 years.
Hurting me? Sure 40% of my gross is gone before I see it...but in the end, I may never own another home - but you know what? That really is not such a big deal anymore.
What is a BIG deal? Your health mental and physical and these deteriorate very quickly when you are in a horrible situation.
You've done the wait and see for quite a while areadly haven't you? You owe it to yourself and your son to be happy. I left the 6 figure income and big house- it didn't make me happy. My worst day single is still better than my best day married. I wake up happy and I go to bed happy. So yes, I say suck it up, swallow your loss, and make it official- afterall, it's only money!
I am still paying for my divorce. It cost me more than 30K. If you can still share a home but not a marriage then more power to ya I say.
Matt-Man, got it! Love *is* (or should be) the reason for marriage - agreed - but then (me thinks) it becomes a matter of mitigating the damages.
Phfrankie Bondo, and another one for "cut and run"
Flyinfox_SATX, I seem to have this need for a secure home - a STRONG need. I know ... I know ... a home doesn't have to mean owning one!
same answer different question - you did it again!
Bond, one of the challenges has been that since coming to terms with where we each are in this relationship, things have actually improved. It just makes the decision that much more unclear.
snugs, I know there are BUNCHES of people who agree with you on this one, but I continue ask myself, "How long is too long to wait?" What if, having the opportunity to express our mutual disgust of the relationship actually makes it better?
g-man, I know of several people who have done this out of necessity and I've seen mixed results. At the very least, I know that we'll be filing taxes separately this year.
doggybloggy, that's because I want someone to tell me that some how - some way - I didn't fail again ... *sigh* ...
It's okay to fail, if that's what you want to call it....but staying doesn't make it not failing.
It's already done.
I'm happier than I've ever been after:
5 years with the first one
1 year with the second one
3 years with the third one
1 year with the second one, again but trust me..she was phenomenal in bed.
3 years with the fourth one
10 years with the fifth one
and now with the love of my life, we're going on three years!
I bet I've got you beat with committed partners. ;)
It takes some of us a bit longer to get it right. But it's worth it!
I took a good sized hit getting divorced three years ago. Still recovering. But, really, I can't put a price on my sanity!
Survival is one thing, being emotionally miserable is another. It's all a matter of priorities.
Dana,
I actually know of people that got divorced and still live together for exactly the reasons you mentioned. It's so much cheaper to keep sharing a house, and have a agreement that states you each get 50% of the equity when you CAN sell it for what it's worth, than to lose money, or sometimes have to PAY to sell your house.
I wouldn't be able to do it. If I ever got divorced, there is no way on God's green earth I could live with the man!
I have been divorced since 96 (was married for 6 years together for 8 - we are still very good friends) - never married the baby mama she has been out of the house since 2001(she was never a friend and still isnt) and now in my present situation for 8 years -
Just the opinion of a dad here, but the only one who should have to suck up anything is you and the hub. In all things, your boy's well being should be first. If that means that Cam will suffer the loss of your husband as father and role model, then I say suck it up and keep them together. If (as I think is probably the case) Cam doesn't really have a role model in this man, and as long as he's not suffering at his hands, then the financials and other issues should be considered. In short, the kids come first. But then, what else would I say?
FMD
Honey, I say get it over with and do the divorce.
Yep. I did a CQW a bit ago on the same topic.
IMO, happiness trumps just about everything. You are very unhappy married to your husband. Yes divorce is expensive, but is it being expensive more important than your happiness? Not in my opinion.....
RLL, but staying doesn't make it not failing ...
Well CRAP! Those few words just ruin my argument, don't they? I think I really need to revisit what it is that is keeping me in this place. My "loyalty" to this marriage is disturbing - even to me.
Vanessa, one of my struggles continues to be whether wanting my "sanity" is selfish. I don't remember "selfish" being in my vows.
Hammer, priorities ... sometimes I wonder if I actually set my own, or if I am so weak I just live someone elses.
Bina, husband could actually afford this home on his own, but isn't willing to do that due to the maintenance factors. It's too bad - that would really be the easiest (and most logical) solution.
doggybloggy, soooo ... I guess that means you make better choices than I do?
FMD, I agree - this really should have minimal impact on Cam. Your second assumption of the relationship between Cam and husband (Cam doesn't really have a role model in this man) is accurate, although one of my fears (clearly not rooted deeply enough) is that husband *will* become a role model for Cam. And I agree, the kids should come first.
rage, I think you are one of the many people who wonder what I'd look like happy and content *wink*
Vixen, I need to search you archives and read the responses on that post. I do wonder if age doesn't play quite a part in this scenario. At 25, the thought of starting over - and knowing I could accomplish what I wanted/needed long term - was an easy goal. At 45? Not so much. I do think I need to remember that Cam isn't 3 - he's 13 - and many of my "arguments" won't be anything in 5 years.
I included the link in my comment above so you wouldn't have to search my archives. I did it for you. :)
Another interesting point that I find intriguing (sorry, not to go comment crazy) is that there was a rise in the divorce rate for awhile. SO many young people were getting married with the thought "If it doesn't work out, we'll just get divorced". Taking such a flippant attitude about the commitment they were making, it felt to me like a 'one foot out the door' type attitude.
So I DO think age plays a factor in how readily a person is willing to leave their marriage. As well as the amount of time the person has been married.
Finances have a *whole* lot to do with the fact that not only have my husband and I *not* filed for divorce yet, but we are also still living in the same house, even though we "split" in March and agreed that we were going to divorce and that we are no longer a couple.
I've been a SAHM for 4 years. My husband is the breadwinner. I can't find a job and he can't afford to put our 2-yr old in daycare. Our arrangement works out for us because we get along much better now that we're "broken up" than we did otherwise. But I can only imagine what a nightmare it must be for other couples in our situation with less tenable relationships and living circumstances.
After reading more of the comments (should have done that first, huh?), I wanted to add that not only are my husband and I still living together with no real idea of when we'll be able to afford even the smallest filing fees for divorce, but my boyfriend is going to be moving in with us this weekend...and a lot of it has to do with economics.
He can't support himself in a household in his city on his salary. The cost of living is less where I am. He'll move up here, go to work, and the three of us will be contributing to the household finances and upkeep. That takes some of the financial burden off of my husband, allows for my boyfriend to relocate (as planned) and for us all to have a little relief in our living situation.
(It's not a long-term solution, of course. We'll be getting our own place within a few months. Since the baby is only 2, she won't be aware of the unusual circumstances, so everyone is okay with it, for now.)
I wonder if this proves that many jump into divorce without much deep thought? I know that when I decided to call it quits finances did not enter into my mind.....I was making about $24K at the time compared to his $126K....I did not get a cent of alimony. Split the profit of selling our home and that is it....I had to borrow the security deposit to put down on a rental house. Money was the least of my worries at the time....if I had to live out of my car, so be it....if I waited until I could afford a divorce, I would still be there 4 years later. I might now be in debt, but I sleep better at night.
Post a Comment