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In these tough economic times people are attempting to save money any way they can. At some point, we may find ourselves faced with an ethically questionable opportunity to safe a few bucks. Frugal ideas can often stretch the bounds of ethical behavior, and can even cross the line into breaking the law.
I've actually done some of these things, others I've read about on frugality blogs. Some I think are frugal, some I think are cheap (different than frugal) and some I think are down right theft.
Bringing outside food/drink into the movies: Sure, it’s a way to save money, but the last time I checked it was strictly against the rules in all of our local theaters. Are you stealing from the movie theater? Or are you just making a statement against their outrageous prices and lack of healthy food options?
Ordering hot/cold water at a restaurant then flavoring it with a drink mix or a tea bag you've brought along: If you’re making your own tea or punch type drink at the table, is that stealing from the restaurant? Or is it a frugal way to cut the cost of a meal?
Lying about the age of your kids, or their student status, in order to get free/discounted admissions. If your kid is 12, and there is a reduction in admission for kids under 12, is it wrong to claim your child is 11? Does the cost to the facility really increase just because a kid turns 12? Is this stealing? Or is it just bending the truth a bit to save a little money?
Lying about your anniversary at a restaurant to get preferential treatment and/or free food. Is this wrong? Or, since you have an anniversary every year, does it not really matter when you "celebrate" it or if you "celebrate" it more than once year?
Laying claim to discounts that you’re not entitled to. If you book a hotel room online and select that you are eligible for the AAA discount, or the AARP discount, even thought you're not an AAA member or quite 50, is it stealing? Or is it acceptable to think "Hey, if they can’t be bothered to check, it must not mean that much to them and they don’t care if I get the discount"?
Reusing coupons in the self check line of the grocery store. Apparently people are rescanning coupons in grocery store self check lines, then inserting blank pieces of paper in the slot when requested, saving the coupons for additional purchases at a later date. Is this stealing from the store? Or is it just a way to maximize your dollar?
Reusing the jumbo plastic cup on multiple visits to a fast food restaurant. Sure, we know the intent is unlimited refills within the same visit, but is it really stealing from the restaurant? Or is it nothing more than making the most of the "unlimited refill" offer?
Using Barnes & Noble like a library. All of the chain bookstores now have comfy seating and most of them have coffee bars. Isn't that an invitation to sit down with a book or magazine for a few hours? Or is it stealing profits from the bookstore to read their books and magazines without any intent of ever purchasing them?
Taking home a few supplies, or running your personal bills through the postage machine at work. Would these things qualify as employee theft? Or does the employer just expect a certain amount of this and include it when figuring out your total compensation?
As J.C. Watts said:
I think many of us have a two sets of ethics - one for individuals and local companies, and one for faceless, capitalistic corporations. We’ll do things to a big company in a heartbeat that we’d never consider doing to an individual.
In the end, we each have to make peace with our own moral compass, but I think we seldom think about how the short-term, money saving "opportunities" might cost us in the long run. Will restaurants start charging for water? Will self-serve drink machines go the way of the dinosaur? Will manufacturers stop producing coupons due to fraud? Will amusement parks and museums start charging the same (higher) price for everyone to stop people from taking advantage of discounts? What about the hit to our personal integrity and conscience? Is it stealing not only from society, but from our soul?
I've actually done some of these things, others I've read about on frugality blogs. Some I think are frugal, some I think are cheap (different than frugal) and some I think are down right theft.
Bringing outside food/drink into the movies: Sure, it’s a way to save money, but the last time I checked it was strictly against the rules in all of our local theaters. Are you stealing from the movie theater? Or are you just making a statement against their outrageous prices and lack of healthy food options?
Ordering hot/cold water at a restaurant then flavoring it with a drink mix or a tea bag you've brought along: If you’re making your own tea or punch type drink at the table, is that stealing from the restaurant? Or is it a frugal way to cut the cost of a meal?
Lying about the age of your kids, or their student status, in order to get free/discounted admissions. If your kid is 12, and there is a reduction in admission for kids under 12, is it wrong to claim your child is 11? Does the cost to the facility really increase just because a kid turns 12? Is this stealing? Or is it just bending the truth a bit to save a little money?
Lying about your anniversary at a restaurant to get preferential treatment and/or free food. Is this wrong? Or, since you have an anniversary every year, does it not really matter when you "celebrate" it or if you "celebrate" it more than once year?
Laying claim to discounts that you’re not entitled to. If you book a hotel room online and select that you are eligible for the AAA discount, or the AARP discount, even thought you're not an AAA member or quite 50, is it stealing? Or is it acceptable to think "Hey, if they can’t be bothered to check, it must not mean that much to them and they don’t care if I get the discount"?
Reusing coupons in the self check line of the grocery store. Apparently people are rescanning coupons in grocery store self check lines, then inserting blank pieces of paper in the slot when requested, saving the coupons for additional purchases at a later date. Is this stealing from the store? Or is it just a way to maximize your dollar?
Reusing the jumbo plastic cup on multiple visits to a fast food restaurant. Sure, we know the intent is unlimited refills within the same visit, but is it really stealing from the restaurant? Or is it nothing more than making the most of the "unlimited refill" offer?
Using Barnes & Noble like a library. All of the chain bookstores now have comfy seating and most of them have coffee bars. Isn't that an invitation to sit down with a book or magazine for a few hours? Or is it stealing profits from the bookstore to read their books and magazines without any intent of ever purchasing them?
Taking home a few supplies, or running your personal bills through the postage machine at work. Would these things qualify as employee theft? Or does the employer just expect a certain amount of this and include it when figuring out your total compensation?
As J.C. Watts said:
"Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught."
I think many of us have a two sets of ethics - one for individuals and local companies, and one for faceless, capitalistic corporations. We’ll do things to a big company in a heartbeat that we’d never consider doing to an individual.
In the end, we each have to make peace with our own moral compass, but I think we seldom think about how the short-term, money saving "opportunities" might cost us in the long run. Will restaurants start charging for water? Will self-serve drink machines go the way of the dinosaur? Will manufacturers stop producing coupons due to fraud? Will amusement parks and museums start charging the same (higher) price for everyone to stop people from taking advantage of discounts? What about the hit to our personal integrity and conscience? Is it stealing not only from society, but from our soul?
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24 comments:
I'm thinking these actions are all wrong. Would people burn in Hell for doing them? Probably not. But why take chances. LOL
All in all, these actions are dishonest, cheating and stealing. If people want to be dishonest, cheat and steal, go for the big bucks. At least when you get caught stealing a couple million dollars, people won't think you're a cheap-ass thief.
Hmmmm, the only one I am guilty of is bringing my own snacks into the movie theatre. Usually it's a bottle of soda. Is it wrong? Probably. Am I going to stop doing it? No, probably not. Is the theatre suffering from it? I am going to say no, because the lines at the concession stand are always long.
All of these things probably are stealing, of course you could always justify it by saying the theatre is downright obnoxiously stealing from you for what they charge.
Not that I have ever justified my actions by saying that. Or anything.
Just saying
;-)
As much of an asshole that I can be, I have an ugly streak of "morality" that prevents me from doing these things. Although I have been known to bring sunflower seeds into a movie theatre with me in order to curb my cigarette craving during the show. Cheers Dana!!
Other than bringing a bottle of water into the movies, I haven't done any of those things. And I ALWAYS have a bottle of water in my purse, so I don't do it intentionally.
Some of hose things are insane - coupons and water. Seriously? You have to be kind a sick to carry a teabag around to save money.
I've run a bill or two through the postage meter at my old job just because I didn't have a stamp on me, not to save money. On ocassion I gave the money gal in the office the postage rate whatever it was at the time. Sometime I didn't just to stick it to them I guess.
I've ordered hot water at a restaurant but when I do, it is just to warm my hands on in the winter, it works great. No I don't waste the water, I do drink it. Sometimes I don't want the calories of hot chocolate. Most times I just order decafe coffee. People look at you so strangely when you order hot water :)
I think the majority of the things you listed are stealing...with the exception of taking your own stuff into the movies. It's legal at a drive-in to cart in your own food, even a charcoal grill if one wants. Why should it be different in regards to carrying your own drink inside? Is it a health regulation? Safety? I don't know. I think carrying one's own bottled water should be tolerate.
The only thing I've done is bring food into a theater. But, that's only when my wife reminds me to do so. With ticket prices so high, it doesn't make sense to her to have to fill out a loan application to get a soda, popcorn, and bag of Twizzlers. Plus, accepting credit cards at the snack stand is an indication they're robbing you.
Left on my own, though, I wouldn't. Not because of a sense of morality. Maybe a sense of...lazy? Ordering a cup of water at a restaurant to make your own drink? Really? And, even though Barnes and Nobles has all those comfy chairs, I just can't bring myself to plop down in one of them to read a Spiderman anthology. I'm just sayin'...
I have not done any of those. I can understand and forgive most of them but the coupons is theft. They also missed one. Grazing in the grocery store. I don't have a problem with people sampling a grape, but I have seen people eat over half a bag then pay for what is left. We find something almost every night where people have ate or drank things and then leave what is left.
The only thing on that list that I have ever done is use Barnes and Noble (or Borders or Hastings or some other bookstore) as a library. While I'm sure that the idea for the comfy chairs is so you can sit down and read the first part of a book (or several books) to decide if you want it or not, I think they know that people are going to be reading whole books on installment plans at their store. Not that THAT makes it honest or right or whatever.
I've also grabbed a couple of magazines at those places and sat down and skimmed through them and then put them back. Which is probably technically stealing or whatever.
As for the theater, I rarely go. And if I do go I don't take anything with me, but I don't buy anything from the concession stand either. So, if I did bring a bottle of water, it's not like I would have bought it from them if I didn't have it.
I've done maybe four of the nine. If I can get away with it, I will slip the coupon sections from other Sunday papers if Sunday has past.
The food courts in our malls don't have 'self serve' soda machines anymore bc of pple totally taking advantage of the refills. It's very annoying, IMO.
The movie theater thing is absurd to me. YES it's against the rules in all theaters to bring in your own food. But why? Bc they want to *force* you to pay exorbitantly high prices to buy shit food. You already paid the price for the movie. Amusement parks allow you to bring in your own food. *shrug* But, yes, at the end of the day, you are breaking a rule that was made. Whether you/I agree with it or not.
That's the only one I am guilty of. The rest, I have too guilty of a conscience to do. And you are right in what you said- enough pple take advantage and eventually it's EVERYONE else that pays the consequences.
...everyone's "moral compass" is different. If it feels like stealing to you then it is. If it doesn't, then it isn't. And although I have never brought anything into a theatre I frickin' LOVE the idea...
we're doomed, I would say the majority of them do fall into the dishonesty bucket. I find it interesting just how many of us are comfortable with that.
Kim, I think part of the reason theaters prohibit it is a liability issue, but I'd also guess there is a bit of a financial incentive as well. Do you think maybe this is more acceptable because lots of people do it?
Matt-Man, I'll admit to the movie theater "theft" AND the hotel discount "theft" I used to work in the hospitality industry and am well aware of the pitfalls of Rack Rate. Morality be damned!
Karen, before the single-serve powdered drinks became available, I knew a LOT of people who would order water with extra lemons, sweeten it with sugar and get free lemonade!
Lu', I'm a huge fan of hot water as a winter drink and yes, people DO look funny at you!
Marsha, my movie theater sells bottled water - I'd say bringing your own bottled water in (assuming they sell it) is no different than bringing in your own popcorn and candy!
I don't know about the liability angle on that Dana. If you bring your own food and choke on it? Whose fault is that? you can't blame the theatre for making the nacho chips too big.
If you choke on food in a restaurant, can you sue the restaurant and win?
Maybe in this country but frankly that's absurd.
I'd say it's more of a financial incentive than anything else. I can't see how a 16 oz slurpee can cost five dollars.
Al Penwasser, I'm with you - some of those things are WAY beyond what I think is acceptable (and legal) behavior!
Howard Bagby, I certainly didn't list all of the things and your comment was proof of that! I've seen many of those empty packaged items strewn throughout the grocery store.
Jay, I don't go to the movies often, but when I do I actually plan on $20-$30 at the concession stand (family of 4) and just don't go unless I can afford that "treat"
Shiny Rod, I know a lot of stores here have stopped allowing internet coupons due to continued and significant abuse. It really does irritate me!
Vixen, I can't help but think that the everyone pays the same due to abuse issue will be everyone pays MORE. It's just kind of selfish on the part of the abusers.
Phfrankie, really? But aren't some of these things breaking the law? Can we honestly say that if it doesn't feel "wrong" to break a law than it isn't breaking a law (for us)?
Kim, you are right! It isn't an issue of liability - it's an issue of profitability. I did a little research and discovered that the movie studios take, on average, 70% of ticket PROFITS. The remaining 30% of the profit on the ticket doesn't even begin to cover the overhead of the theater. So the bottom line? When we take outside food and beverage into a theater instead of purchasing from the overpriced and unhe4althy concession stand, we are likely impacting the future ticket price!
And thus the never ending cycle!!
People will always sneak in food and ticket prices will always be raised.
In the mean time, just call me a heathen!
LOL
The movie thing I have done..when I worked in sales in NYC, if I did not have a lunch date I would go to MCD or BK and get food, put it in my briefcase and go into the movie and watch and eat lunch...
heck - $4 for a hot dog...nah..I will buy my 2 cheeseburgers and fries for $3
Theatres actually make very little money off the price of admission - renting the films to show at their establishment is very expensive. Concessions is where the money is made. (I used to work at a theatre).
That being said, I don't drink sodas and always have a bottle of water with me. I have serious anxiety issues and a couple of sips of cold water usually makes me feel less anxious.
I haven't done any of the other things, though.
Wow, thanks for all the great ideas!
I'm gonna be saving big this coming month!!!
I will tell you that the one area I have absolutely no remorse in, is in the music industry.
I have purchased so many copies of my favorite songs and albums in so many formats because of the volatility of the technology that I have absolutely no remorse in sharing my Itunes playlists.
The Music industry complains that they are getting ripped off. Yeah? Why can't I keep the rights to the song I just purchased simply because you have moved formats from cassette to CD? Why do I have to purchase it again every time a new technology comes out?
I can honestly, and proudly, say that I have never done anything of those things. Heck, I've never even considered some of them! I'm too honest (I've always thought so) and I would feel far to guilty to outweigh any benefits.
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